March 23, 2010
Edited Version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0BW9cmkN0E
0:41:40 A bit of audio gets cut off and I'm pretty sure it's Sam Harris saying "That's not how you discover what happened before the big bang."
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March 23, 2010
Edited Version: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0BW9cmkN0E
0:41:40 A bit of audio gets cut off and I’m pretty sure it’s Sam Harris saying “That’s not how you discover what happened before the big bang.”
This Channel is completely devoted to Sam Harris. It has a complete list of every video he has ever appeared in. As well as versions of every debate he has been in that are edited to be only him speaking. So if you like Sam Harris why not subscribe?
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15:40 – Deepak Chopra is a charlatan of titanic proportions.
Absolutely no excuse for this fuckwittery.
Chopra mixes real science with pseudoscience nonsense culled from an
extremely broad and ephemeral brand of spirituality–he has no evidence and
asserts a whole host of things without evidence by bootstrapping them to
real concepts in a way that the uninformed cannot call out. He is either
delusional or a con man.
Houston seems like a nice person, but her arguments amount to quoting poets
on equal footing with scientists as to the nature of reality.
Sam’s concept of GOD and Deepak’s concept are so drastically divergent,
that no real debate is possible. Deepak fully understand’s Sam’s idea of
GOD, but Sam does not and cannot follow Deepak’s vision. Sam is debating
religious myth. Deepak is attempting to explain a reality beyond Sam’s
grasp.
One thing should be clear to us all; fear is the transformative locomotion
of cognitive introspection that will ultimately disenfranchise our
conscious capacities with total ambiguity. It is not the exclusive
awakening of our immaterial souls that engender the postmodern
biosynthesis, but rather the amorphous assembly of protoplasmic responses
to our self contained blissful streams of consciousness. Hopefully we can
one day connect in a non-local way so that our great commune of eternal
conscious interdependence can manifest in the glory of nature and in the
universal entity that observes the strength of each and every one of us.
Consciousness can overcome fear if the singular aspect of truth can be
plucked from the flower of babbling wisdom at the heart of every human
being on this beautiful earth of ours.
The sensible ones will have immediately recognised the gibberish I just
spewed out; the Deepak Chopra fans will probably want me to write a book.
Jean: “…like the time I caught the ferry over to Shelbyville. I needed a
new heel for my shoe, so, I decided to go to Morganville, which is what
they called Shelbyville in those days. So I tied an onion to my belt, which
was the style at the time. Now, to take the ferry cost a nickel, and in
those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on ’em. Give me five bees
for a quarter, you’d say.”
Every time it’s Jean’s turn I look up from my laptop and watch the TV for a
bit. haha
Who is Jean, and why does it seem like she’s tripping balls?
You know what made me respect Deepak Chopra? Well, I was watching these
science guys, Dawkins and Harris etc, wiping the floor with him in debates.
Just, obliterating him viciously. literally calling him stupid in public-
and then I thought, wait a minute…this guy never looks insulted or gives
signs of a wounded ego! It’s really amazing to me he never gets angry or
frustrated at anything! So I started to feel respect for him.
I honestly have no idea what in the heck Deepak Chopra and Jean Houston
talk about when they speak. It’s like listening to politicians, they just
drone on and on while ultimately not really saying anything meaningful at
all. I would watch the only Sam Harris edited version, but I like hearing
both sides of the debate, even if I disagree with one, just for the sake of
context.
I’ll give Deepak Chopra credit…he is a master at the art of talking
without saying anything.
— What is God? —
Hebrew understanding of God is a little more complicated than what most
Christians, Muslims, or even atheist imagine. In a nutshell, God is
described as “Ein Sof”, a word loosely translated as “the Limitless”
(Infinite). Also, God is called “Ha Makom”, a word translated as “The
Place”; what Place? the place inside which our whole Universe is located.
Thus, Hebrew religion compares God to an infinite man; a man so incredibly
huge, that our own universe (and everything contained in it) is just a
subatomic particle, contained within one of God’s atoms, contained within
one of God’s molecules, contained within one of God’s cells, contained
within one of God’s organs, contained within God’s “body”. And, just like
the subatomic particles of our own body spontaneously come into and out of
existence (without affecting the well being of the whole body), even if we
humans were capable of the worst kind of evil (destroying our whole
universe), it wouldn’t affect God’s existence in the slightest amount.
Also, being so infinitely large, God would encompass our whole nuniverse
(which is only one of the subatomic particles of His “body”), without
actually being in our universe (or even existing inside of it!). There’s
more! God wouldn’t be that infinitely large (physical) body, but rather the
non physical “thing” (or “soul”) that lies beyond that body, and powers it.
Again, the Hebrew sages knew the former was only a crude comparison; God
is much more! In other words, God isn’t just “a Big glorified human”; He’s
infinitely more! God doesn’t have a limited form, nor does He shares our
physical limitations within time and space, as time and space are also
“inside” of Him. One example of this might be that a human being isn’t
aware, and cannot control, what’s going on inside his cells (let alone
inside his subatomic particles!). But, although infinite, God knows exactly
what’s going on everywhere, and has final control of everything. That’s why
Hebrew believers praise their God, because He is indeed an Awesome thing.
Still, why is this view despised by the general population? Well because,
it implies we human beings are so infinitely small that, compared to the
Creator, both our existence as well as our realm of existence, amounts to
little more than nothing. And, it goes without saying that, our so called
“science”, amounts to even less. But man loves to fancy himself of being a
great thing!; he considers himself great enough to be the measure of all
kind of perfection; so great as to be certain that his so called “science”
is suitable to be the absolute standard of truth and morality. Man’s
arrogance conveniently makes him forget that, in the final analysis, he is
little more than a talking and walking leather bag, full of excrement, and
urine. He forgets that his great “science” can’t yet cure aging, death, or
even a common cold. He forgets that the squid (a dumb beast) can become
invisible inside it’s sea environment; thus displaying a far more advanced
technology than what we humans have (yet humble the squid knows of no
pride, nor arrogance!).
So, God’s existence isn’t humanity’s real problem; it’s humanity’s
unwillingness to come to terms with it’s true place in life; a place where
kindness springs from the humility of recognizing we are not the infinite
God, but rather a small, finite, and insignificant part of the Universe.
You claim there’s no such fantastic thing as a God??? Well, if we pause,
and consider the reality of the fantastic scale of the Cosmos, we would be
forced to conclude that, only the fantastic, is likely to be real.
Michael types of skeptics are dangerous. That type of atheism is
dangerous.
It presumes that Man should CONTINUE to dominate the earth , other species
and other people.
Instead when we believe in God. God is Nature is Truth, and Man ‘s world is
Artificial and is Lies.
The Planet was here before us, as were the plants and animals, none of
which need us to survive and we are in fact killing them that produced
us(created us) and gave us life.
What do we do in return of this gift?
We exploit and destroy. Why? Capitalism. Profit. Greed!!! So we can
accumulate wealth. Not so we can solve world problems, not so we can end
hunger or homelessness, not to make the world a better place, but to create
an extremely high standard of living for some at the expense of all others,
incl the very planet and other species .
Since we are DEPENDENT upon THEM. They in Truth, dominate us, but we do not
live in accordance w/ this Truth.
The Future of God would be for us to recognize our proper place, stop the
Anthropocentrism and recognize that Nature is dominate over us and LIVE
THAT WAY. This world as man has created it is a mess, at Man’s command.
and Michael would have us do even more harm with that perspective.
Not to mention the arrogance and ignorance of it. If he wants scientific
statements to support he belief in God as well as the Future of God I could
give him plenty! as well as plenty of references spiritually from every
religious text to correspond to it!
Damn I wish I were in the debate I could really give him an ear full on
this.
The Future of God” is to return to and to adopt the ways of the INDIGENOUS
peoples of the world, you know the ones that were conquered and
colonialized, forcing our language and religon on them, committing genocide
and cultural genocide? lying murdering and stealing, both labor and
resources
The Native Americans as well as other indigenous peoples KNOW how to treat
the Earth and live in Harmony with her.
We came from the Stars, we are the stuff stars are made of (Father in
Heaven) and Mother Earth.
Gandhi said “You can judge the moral progress of a Nation by the way it
treats it’s animals”
and if that is true, which I believe it is, then if we save the animals and
earth , we at the same time, and in the act of doing so, muster up many
virtues in the process and raise the morality of the nation, when you do
that we are much closer to a world that lives in Peace.
It’s funny to me that that is TRULY our problem as a species, yet NONE of
these “new age gurus” EVER mentions morality!!!
or our lack thereof.
too busy selling books I guess and that isn’t a popular notion, they are
selling some kind of individualized happiness, to worldly success and
selfishness. yes, just what the world needs MORE OF!
I find it disgusting that people like Deepak attempt to take ownership of
the scientific endeavors made over the last few centuries by real
scientists and adding his own interpretation/distortion of these endeavors
to try to show a new way of finding god. While Deepak’s overall position in
this debate (organized religion is no longer relevant, recognizing
humankind’s need for love, compassion etc.) can be easily agreed with, the
caveat here is that beneath his so called “warmth” there lies yet another
talking snake. Deepak wants to create a new organized religion and he wants
to be the pope.
Mankind has a very long history of bad religion. All religions fail and
fail miserably because they are based on lies. Deepak’s new religion is no
different. He is selling the same salvation that every other religion sells
only repackaged and modernized with a scientific slant.
I think the more important question then Is there a God is, is there an
afterlife? Imo, the idea of God was created and exists because of our fear
of death (the unknown). There is nothing more fearful then the idea that we
simply end when we die, so we need to create an invisible father and
protector that will save us from the unknown of death and instill in us
hope that we as individuals, will continue “existing” in some way or form
after dying. Heaven, reincarnation, returning to the ocean of conscious
energy, whatever the belief, it’s wanting to believe that we do not simply
turn off for eternity like a light bulb.
The Observer Effect is NOT ABOUT CONSCIOUSNESS.
Anything that interacts with the subatomic particle makes it lose
it’s indeterminacy.
The photosensitive device, for example, will detect them, whether there
are humans around or not.
How can one not want to break out in laughter when Deepthroat Chopra talks.
I don’t mean his accent. I’m talking about the shit he spews. He is such a
tool! “Fuzzy words.”
Sam Harris is phenomenal! His reasoning and scope of understanding of
Religion and Science particularly in his field of Neuroscience is
captivating, and his ability to remain composed under fire while offering
clear, concise and constructive arguments to support his claims is
exceptional. In the debates that I have encountered with Sam his opponents
usually resort to facetiousness as a means of discrediting his views but
with little success. Even if you don’t agree with his stance he still
manages to hold your attention and makes you think.
the lady was lost in this debate and was jumping in and out of the subject,
she was not a good member of this panel.
Deepak is SO butthurt lol
Deepak Chopra needs to learn how to debate as an adult and not just shout
over the top of others!
The more science learns about reality, the further back ‘God’ gets pushed.
Even Deepak has pushed his God back to the beginning of the Big Bang and
then accepts the laws of Physics take over. The future of God is whatever
one chooses to believe in, and Deepak will keep selling his brand of Snake
Oil to those that need to believe in a Deity.
-JEAN WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THERE BEING INTELLIGENCE BEHIND ALL MATTER?
-MY PERSPECTIVE IS DIFFERENT, IF DISCUSSING THIS HELPS HUMANITY THEN WE
SHOULD DISCUSS IT
Well discuss it for fuck’s sake HAHAHAHAHAH, how high is that girl
Finding myself having a spirited and heated debate with myself speaking to
the computer screen! Wish I could have participated , I’d have a helluva
lot to say to Michael!!!
Sam won the debate about religion. However – the word religion was not part
of the subject of the debate. Deepak won the debate about god despite Sam’s
trying to drag the debate onto his home ground of ‘Iron Age Religion’. Sam
was right that the core issue is the definition of what the word ‘god’
means. Be careful what you think it means because your definition of it
does NOT limit the divine, it limits you by defining who you think you are
in relationship to the whole of existence. – Good luck, may the force be
with you !
I really wish Deepak would stop using the term God. Clearly whatever he is
trying to say is not the same as the ideas of monotheistic Christians,
Jews, and Muslims. These religious groups, from what I’ve experienced it’s
mostly Christians, use what Deepak is saying as a “proof” for their God.
This is not the case. Deepak is simply talking (and making bizarre claims
about) consciousness. Nothing of which has to do with the ridiculous idea
of Christianity. Deepak, stop using the word God, because religious people
are using it to try to justify their ideas!
1:15:00 kinda summarize the problem. When you dont know the language of a
particular school of thought you call it woo woo, like when geologists or
astronomists talk. The difference is that geologists and astronomists can
demonstrate that what they say is not woo woo, Deepak cant, he can only use
more woo.
Did you know that 51% of American scientists believe there is a higher
power. Atheists don’t like talking about these figures or they dismiss
them.
Why cant atheist debate without distorting the truth and subject they are
debating, tricks and lies are not the way to win people to atheism as the
truth will come out in time.
Our consciousness projects onto the light of abstract beauty.
The contempt and conceit shown in this discussion by Shermer and Harris is
obnoxious.
One again Sam Harris is the only one with a point, that finishes a thought.
Jean is just out there enjoying her claps from women (irrelevant) and
Chopra is talking, yes, woo-woo.
Sam Harris speaks and the debate is over!
and jean really was the most balanced. Glad they had some feminine balance
This woman is crazy. She wants to be God.. she is eve’s daughter… nor
does she know who Wisdom is
Deepak sounds like a spiritual science charlatan until he laughed at
Young’s Double slit, which is in the basis of quantum mechanics, after he
had talked about QM. Then he became an obscene ignorant.
The fuck is the experience of water? Dumb mother fucker needs to stick to
healthy balls.
Oxytocin is one of the passive hormones of passive aggressive
co-dependency, not love.
Who are the morons clapping when Deepak throws out his word salad? And why
is Jean Houston on this stage.
That chic was a horrible co-defendant for Deepak.
Anger and arrogance doesn’t make the point. Deepak should have kept his
cool and spoken convincingly.
Michael Shermer is a deeply simple man.
What happens at that quantum level is definitely strange, but how does this
prove god?
Jean Houston made the most sense while the others engaged in a shouting
match.
if good see what it had created he will kill himself.
good exist but it exist in other dimension and in other form and not in
heaven.and not in belive.
good is destiny consciousness enery and laws of univers.
I’ve been watching hours and hours of this debate. One completely
unaddressed issue. The human body, which is special, and not just an
extension of apes, is itself a scientific instrument. Absence of evidence
IS NOT evidence of absence. Sam needs to do a lengthy meditation retreat,
or, on the Western style, drop some acid. Instead of working, he is
satisfied to talk and talk . . . Not very scientific.
The lady (which I don’t know her name) talked a couple of times, but
actually didn’t say ANYTHING on the subject. She couldn’t even answer the
questions she was being addressed. Deepak… I’ve never before listened to
him and to be honest.. a total disappointment.
39:00, pretty much won the argument there. If not, it was definitely a
point that should be well noted in this video!
The Indian dude is so but-hurt. Its just hilarious to see him fight on a
lost battlefield : D
Shermer also jumps when Harris starts talking. Does he fear his superior
intellect or does he forget he’s even there sometimes?